What Every Potential Expat Should First Consider Before Moving To Panama'

[Dottie Atwater]

40 minutes ago, Roger B said:

 

It has been interesting for me that it is considered "human" if you have a farm animal like a horse, house pet, etc i to place them "to sleep" because they are having terrible suffering from their disease, illness or wounds but that same "human" treatment is not given to person who have terminal disease and are suffering to much with pain. 

How true!  It's ridiculous that laws dictate what we can and cannot do with our bodies.

[JoJo]

5 hours ago, Roger B said:

 

It has been interesting for me that it is considered "human" if you have a farm animal like a horse, house pet, etc i to place them "to sleep" because they are having terrible suffering from their disease, illness or wounds but that same "human" treatment is not given to person who have terminal disease and are suffering to much with pain. 

I agree Roger. That's pretty backwards thinking.

[JohnF13]

I just cannot see why the American government would extend health care to people who have left their Country for a better/cheaper life somewhere else.  As others have said, America looks after it's own interests, any money spent here is to support American policies and/or the canal.  But, of course, that doesn't prevent the entitlement mentality of some living here.

[Keith Woolford]

23 hours ago, Jim Tosch said:

I don't think many countries ever give aid except to further their own agenda. However self-serving aid is still aid. The fact that the US invests in keeping the canal safe is critically important to Panama. Ironically, the main threat to the canal is the fact that it is so important to the US.. 

Jim, I think you're a victim of popular misconception. the US gov gives hundreds of millions in aid to Panama every year

Here's an example of Panama shelling out $ to cleanup after the U.S. military.

Where's the foreign aid there?

THE CLEAN UP  of the former U.S. Army weapons testing ground in Piña, Colón is going to cost Panama $1.1 million.

http://www.newsroompanama.com/news/panama/clean-up-of-former-us-military-site-to-cost-1-1-million?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+newsroompanama+%28Newsroom+Panama%29

[Jim Tosch]

I will never claim to understand what the US gov does or does not do. Also I should leave out the word gov. Because much of the money comes from the private sector. But next year it is Canada's turn with the commitment to build a fifty million dollar university somewhere in Panama. Maybe Panama should give Canadians free health care.

[JoJo]

6 hours ago, Jim Tosch said:

I will never claim to understand what the US gov does or does not do. Also I should leave out the word gov. Because much of the money comes from the private sector. But next year it is Canada's turn with the commitment to build a fifty million dollar university somewhere in Panama. Maybe Panama should give Canadians free health care.

Why? Canadians already get free health care. That 50 million dollars could be better spent on free healthcare for the poor in Panama.

[Jim Tosch]

it's joking and playing. Lighten up.

Panama is not suffering other than some money nobody seems to be able to account for. If I were going to recommend care for Canadians it would be psychiatric. If you think the Panamanian's need a better health care system, you might also look at their education system and their infrastructure, but it is not because they lack money

[JoJo]

2 hours ago, Jim Tosch said:

it's joking and playing. Lighten up.

Panama is not suffering other than some money nobody seems to be able to account for. If I were going to recommend care for Canadians it would be psychiatric. If you think the Panamanian's need a better health care system, you might also look at their education system and their infrastructure, but it is not because they lack money

Well excuse me Jim, I'm still trying to figure out what part was joking and playing. 

Building a 50 million university is one thing, staffing it is another. Like all the hospitals they are building with no equipment, supplies, doctors or nurses to staff them. It's like so what?

I'm not trying to be difficult here, but we just see things differently about what joking and playing means, and that's okay. Doesn't mean either of us are bad people. ;o) Peace.

[Jim Tosch]

there is no rational for what happens down here. They build airports and roads to nowhere and finish them years later. They just decide to build with no budget for completion. But, one day you drive by and it's open. The market in Boquete received a large grant from a foreign country to be completed. Meanwhile the gov bought boats and radar systems that would not function. There is one new airport that has no scheduled flights. The Ruta Del sur has had a road but no bridge for years but now they are discussing it. It is a combination of mañana, juega vivo , and election results to mention a few. After awhile you just have to shake your head and laugh.

[Brundageba]

On 11/22/2015, 7:57:17, Keith Woolford said:

Jim, I think you're a victim of popular misconception. the US gov gives hundreds of millions in aid to Panama every year

Here's an example of Panama shelling out $ to cleanup after the U.S. military.

Where's the foreign aid there?

THE CLEAN UP  of the former U.S. Army weapons testing ground in Piña, Colón is going to cost Panama $1.1 million.

http://www.newsroompanama.com/news/panama/clean-up-of-former-us-military-site-to-cost-1-1-million?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+newsroompanama+%28Newsroom+Panama%29

Read the book:

Emperors in the Jungle,  author: Linsey-Polland

The amount of chemical weapons tested here and left here by the American government is astounding.   This book is an eye-opener !!!!   The testing of these weapons here in the Rep of Panama by the US government was as well an eyeopener putting animals and people ( American soldiers from Puerto Rico) purposely in harms way.   Makes me ashamed (.....very ashamed) of my country, the USA.   I look at the great expanses of green space all around Panama City as well the islands offshore, and I always ponder what was left there by my government to rot under the overgrowth. 

[Marcelyn]

On November 22, 2015 at 9:14:12 AM, Jim Tosch said:

I will never claim to understand what the US gov does or does not do. Also I should leave out the word gov. Because much of the money comes from the private sector. But next year it is Canada's turn with the commitment to build a fifty million dollar university somewhere in Panama. Maybe Panama should give Canadians free health care.

 

Jim:  what about Canada's commitment to building a fifty million dollar university in Panama?  What is the major area of study for potential students?

[Jim Tosch]

Marcelyn, This is really interesting stuff. It is all about solar power and other renewable energy. If you will Google Skypower Energy Panama I think you will be amazed. A Canadian Company has big and much needed plans for the youth of Panama.

[Marcelyn]

51 minutes ago, Jim Tosch said:

Marcelyn, This is really interesting stuff. It is all about solar power and other renewable energy. If you will Google Skypower Energy Panama I think you will be amazed. A Canadian Company has big and much needed plans for the youth of Panama.

 

Double WOW!  Click here for more information:

 

[JudyS]

On 11/22/2015, 7:02:58, JohnF13 said:

I just cannot see why the American government would extend health care to people who have left their Country for a better/cheaper life somewhere else.  As others have said, America looks after it's own interests, any money spent here is to support American policies and/or the canal.  But, of course, that doesn't prevent the entitlement mentality of some living here.

Entitlement mentality?  Wanting to use the Medicare insurance I pay into every month is "entitlement mentality"?  The U.S. govt. pays for medical care all over the world to people with TriCare.  Why should Medicare be any different?  I resent being called a recipient of an entitlement, like I'm collecting welfare, when I paid into that system my whole adult life with the expectation of it being available to me when I retired. 

[Bonnie]

2 minutes ago, JudyS said:

Entitlement mentality?  Wanting to use the Medicare insurance I pay into every month is "entitlement mentality"?  The U.S. govt. pays for medical care all over the world to people with TriCare.  Why should Medicare be any different?  I resent being called a recipient of an entitlement, like I'm collecting welfare, when I paid into that system my whole adult life with the expectation of it being available to me when I retired. 

Moreover, the government would pay much less here than it would if the medicare recipient lived in the States. There just aren't enough expats to have the political clout necessary to change the law in this regard.

[Gordon Bakke]

Well this discussion has certainly gone all over the map.

[WryAwry]

4 minutes ago, Gordon Bakke said:

Well this discussion has certainly gone all over the map.

Any info on repatriating to Botswana or Kamchatka?

[JoJo]

36 minutes ago, Gordon Bakke said:

Well this discussion has certainly gone all over the map.

How so? The issue with Medicare IS something to think about for expats is it not?

[Marcelyn]

5 hours ago, WryAwry said:

Any info on repatriating to Botswana or Kamchatka?

 

Workin on it.  More info on this repatriating thing later. ?

[C Richardson]

Another thing to consider is RESIDENCY LAWS of the STATE you are departing for TAX PURPOSES. Some states consider you a resident for life if you dont first reestablish yourself in another state in the US.

Two states with aggressive tax codes are California and Virginia. Virginia considers you a resident even if you leave the country and declares this in its Partial Year State Tax filing instructions, if you do not take the proper actions as well as expressing your intent to leave in writing. There are a couple other states that are just as possessive and as more states find their deficits increasing along with projected revenues declining I am willing to bet that more states will be getting aggressive in their attempts to collect tax revenue using little other than assumptions and your former and possibly current ties to the state.

A former California resident who worked as a real estate agent and left California to permanently move out of the country in 2009 received such a surprise. Three years later the state of California's department of taxation notified her that she owed a $400,000.00 tax bill based on nothing more than the average income of a real estate agent in the state and the fact that she had last resided there and not established herself in another state of the US.  

The problem is that many do not take the necessary steps to 'divorce' themselves from the state. When you move to another state in the US what usually makes the move official is the surrender of the previous state driver's license and application for licensing in the new state  Yet when you move overseas no such procedure occurs where your state is notified of your new residency. Few people fail to see the importance of surrendering your old state driver's license. This may prove to be a costly souvenir.

You can find some of the needed steps to take and the language to use spelled out in the Partial Year Tax form instructions for your state. Be warned that not everything is spelled out for you so you have to consider what contracts and priveleges have you established with the state and rescind, cancel, or surrender them formally as opposed to just allowing them to expire.

Virginia looks at whether or not you have any remaining property interest. Did you cancel and surrender your drivers license once you received one in the country in which you now reside? Did you rescind your voter registration? Yes, even an uncancelled library card can be used against you as well as any document or permit issued by the state which you do not surrender. 

In addition to all of this the Commonwealth of Virginia requires "Expressed Intent" and still reserves the right to consider you their resident, but if you take all of the necessary steps you are more likely to be treated as a non resident. Give one of these possessive states any reason to consider you their resident and you may have an unpleasant surprise tax bill sent to you in the future.      

 

[Penny]

I don't believe the much quoted statement that the U.S. government would save money by paying our medicare expenses here. Right now they pay 0% of 90% our our expenses. It's only occasionally someone returns to the U.S. to take advantage of medicare payments.

The U.S. government is saving a ton. Probably the only thing in the history of the world the government has managed to save money on.

[Bonnie]

8 hours ago, Penny said:

I don't believe the much quoted statement that the U.S. government would save money by paying our medicare expenses here. Right now they pay 0% of 90% our our expenses. It's only occasionally someone returns to the U.S. to take advantage of medicare payments.

The U.S. government is saving a ton. Probably the only thing in the history of the world the government has managed to save money on.

Perhaps not in total.  But medical care costs less here than it does in the States. When folks return to the States to take advantage of Medicare, the government pays more than it would if those people had stayed here and could collect on their Medicare. There probably are others who would expatriate, thereby saving Medicare money, but do not do so because Medicare doesn't pay here. But, at bottom, it's a question of fairness to my mind. We paid all our working lives into a system that we cannot collect on even though our collections would cost little when compared to the same costs in the U.S.

[Brundageba]

Recent post on .Ning:

"We're leaving"...................

"We decided to move, we have little kids and realized pretty fast it is not safe to raise kids here. We met a lot of conartists who live in Boquete and try to convince people that this is a great place to raise kids, very safe, and that the economy is booming here and it's easy to make a living. Completely untrue!!! Where we live in the US it is very safe, and you do not need bars in the windows nor security systems. I have traveled a lot, and I dislike Panama the most as people constantly try to rip you off and lie like crazy. By the way, I am originally from Europe so I know how life is both in Europe and US. I have never met a culture that is so rude and openly hostile towards white people. Living in denial does not excuse you from reality. Sooner or later reality will make you pay."

_______________________________________________

I just read the above a few minutes ago and was interested to see when the first post on Ning appeared from this individual.  It was April 2015.  Unfortunate that a failure to do prior research before moving an entire family lock, stock and barrel to a foreign country ends up in a rant against the people of that country and the country itself.  This family is leaving angry.  By their perception they have been ripped off.  They are returning back to their prior home where bars on windows are not necessary nor are security systems...and there, nobody rips you off nor cons you.  People there are not rude nor openly hostile.  Well I hope it works out that way for them.  This is an example of what so many of us predicted not so very long ago.  My question is...where did they get their information prior to leaving and settling here with their children?

[JohnF13]

On November 30, 2015 at 4:31 PM, Bonnie said:

Perhaps not in total.  But medical care costs less here than it does in the States. When folks return to the States to take advantage of Medicare, the government pays more than it would if those people had stayed here and could collect on their Medicare. There probably are others who would expatriate, thereby saving Medicare money, but do not do so because Medicare doesn't pay here. But, at bottom, it's a question of fairness to my mind. We paid all our working lives into a system that we cannot collect on even though our collections would cost little when compared to the same costs in the U.S.

Bonnie, of course you can collect, just go back to the US, accept the higher cost of living and pay sales taxes.  You can't really expect the US government to pay medical bills in every Country of the World can you?  It is the same for the rest of us, we need to buy insurance at a substantial cost.  I pay taxes in Canada but would have to return for 90 days before I would qualify for "free" medical.

[JudyS]

The U.S. could at least pay those Panama hospitals that are affiliated with U.S. hospitals, like Punta Pacifica and Johns Hopkins.  Also the U.S. govt. administers TriCare payments all over the world.  Why should Medicare be any different?  So yes, I do expect the U.S. govt. to let me use Medicare in Panama at least at Punta Pacifica.