Chica de Chiriqui Posted October 18, 2015 Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) Many expats who come to Panama fail to consider the effect they have on a very fragile system.Citizens of Panama are desperate to have a health care system that works. They pay seguro monthly to provide a modicum of care for their families.Outsiders thoughtlessly arrive without considering well-being of the existing populace, and then, when they have their inevitable health crisis, expect the struggling hospital system to care for them, without having contributed to support it.If you aren't well insured, don't come, or go home if you are already here. Edited October 18, 2015 by Chica de Chiriqui 1 1 Quote
Bonnie Posted October 18, 2015 Posted October 18, 2015 (edited) I couldn't agree more, Chica de Chiriqui. Anyone who doesn't have good health insurance or has insurance that doesn't pay providers directly but only reimburses, should either have a substantial financial cushion or a credit card with a substantial maximum.For expats, health insurance is a personal responsibility, not a government or community responsibility. Edited October 18, 2015 by Bonnie grammar Quote
Marcelyn Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 Good information in both prior posts.I don't want to be harsh, but several people have told me they have "donor fatigue" from all the recent requests for donations to help pay for hospital expenses, etc. for yet another expat who doesn't have insurance or sufficient finances to pay for their health care.Not sure what the long term answer is --- any thoughts out there? Quote
JohnF13 Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 Unfortunately, the long term answer is simple - spend the money and get good insurance. Your homr government isn't going to send a medivac plane to take you back for treatment, no matter how much you wish it so. Quote
JudyS Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 If you do hire a medivac plane, it will cost you $30,000 - $45,000, depending on where you are going. Quote
Yella Posted October 19, 2015 Posted October 19, 2015 Anyone looking for accurate information about health insurance available in Panama should contact a reputable agent who can speak English and explain how it works here in this country. I recommend Magda Crespo Insurance located in Plaza San Francisco in Alto Boquete. Phone number for their office is 720-3240. Magda is a licensed agent and native resident of Chiriqui Province. She not only can help you find the right health coverage for you, she can help you find the right doctor for individual health issues. Magda is an amazing resource for us expats who don't know the protocol, the system or the procedures involved in taking care of our needs. Magda Crespo Insurance also offers insurance for your property, life or car. 1 Quote
TxJackie Posted November 15, 2015 Posted November 15, 2015 I find it incredible that people buy $500,000 houses but fail to get health insurance. Then when they have a medical emergency, they ask everyone else to help pay their bills. If you want to live in Panama you need to either have health insurance or set aside sufficient money to pay for you own medical expenses or have a large credit limit on your credit card so you can pay for your medical emergencies. I discoverd that is is about 30-50% cheaper to buy health insurance directly from the insurance company vs buying through an insurance broker. When my daughter moved to Panama, I contacted an insurance broker to get international health insurance quote for her. I was shocked to find that the quote was more than I'm paying. I bought my health insurance directly from an worldwide medical - through United Healthcare. So, instead of paying $2400 which the insurance broker quoted, she is paying $965 a year. Big savings! Quote
Marcelyn Posted November 15, 2015 Posted November 15, 2015 Can you give me the contact information for your worldwide medical supplier? Thanks. Quote
Brundageba Posted November 15, 2015 Posted November 15, 2015 Everyone needs to do their own homework. Unfortunately this was a resource of information on Ning that was hashed and re-hashed. IF you are over 65...you will be paying a considerable sum of $$ for full insurance coverage from a reputable provider. The MS Chiriqui plan is minimal. Many come here and drop their Medicare B to save $100 a month...that's crazy. This is a very serious topic...one each person who even thinks about moving here needs to fully research. Quote
JudyS Posted November 15, 2015 Posted November 15, 2015 (edited) I didn't take Part B when I turned 65, because I couldn't use it. A few years later, I did the calculations and found there is no advantage to dropping Part B if you ever anticipate receiving medical care in the U.S. Over a lifetime, if you enroll later, you will pay much more. I wish I had just kept it when I qualified at 65. I re-signed up at age 71 and am paying about $160/month instead of $106. I know I will be going back to the States eventually. Being very old here is a nightmare. You don't want to be here when you are ancient, if you are that lucky (or unlucky). There are no services available like there are in the U.S. Edited November 15, 2015 by JudyS Quote
Bonnie Posted November 15, 2015 Posted November 15, 2015 1 hour ago, Marcelyn said: Can you give me the contact information for your worldwide medical supplier? Thanks. Gloria Detresno detresno@usa.net 6615-6391 Gloria and her husband Pedro are simply the best. I went to her on the recommendation of Penny Barrett and have never been happier with service. They even come to your house to deliver documents and collect payments. 1 Quote
Brundageba Posted November 15, 2015 Posted November 15, 2015 Judy S Yes.....dropping Part B of Medicare is a huge mistake. The US govt hopes you do believe me ! When I hear folks retired here who say "If I paid for Part B out of my Soc Sec monthly I would not be able to buy food": To those folks I say....go back (or stay) in the USA. If your margin is $100 (+ or -) then you are too close on the margin. **** happens here. Plan on it happening. 1 Quote
Bonnie Posted November 17, 2015 Posted November 17, 2015 On 11/15/2015, 3:44:29, JudyS said: I didn't take Part B when I turned 65, because I couldn't use it. A few years later, I did the calculations and found there is no advantage to dropping Part B if you ever anticipate receiving medical care in the U.S. Over a lifetime, if you enroll later, you will pay much more. I wish I had just kept it when I qualified at 65. I re-signed up at age 71 and am paying about $160/month instead of $106. I know I will be going back to the States eventually. Being very old here is a nightmare. You don't want to be here when you are ancient, if you are that lucky (or unlucky). There are no services available like there are in the U.S. An equally important consideration is that if you decide to re-enroll in Medicare it can only be done in the month of January and will not become effective until the following July. I had friends who could not afford insurance here and had significant health problems which they could address only by returning to the States and taking advantage of Medicare. Unfortunately, they left Panama in July only to find that their Medicare coverage would not begin until the following July. Quote
Marcelyn Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 12 hours ago, Bonnie said: An equally important consideration is that if you decide to re-enroll in Medicare it can only be done in the month of January and will not become effective until the following July. I had friends who could not afford insurance here and had significant health problems which they could address only by returning to the States and taking advantage of Medicare. Unfortunately, they left Panama in July only to find that their Medicare coverage would not begin until the following July. On November 15, 2015 at 3:57:01 PM, Brundageba said: Judy S Yes.....dropping Part B of Medicare is a huge mistake. The US govt hopes you do believe me ! When I hear folks retired here who say "If I paid for Part B out of my Soc Sec monthly I would not be able to buy food": To those folks I say....go back (or stay) in the USA. If your margin is $100 (+ or -) then you are too close on the margin. **** happens here. Plan on it happening. I didn't know it was possible to have Part A and not also enroll for Part B for Medicare. I've always had both and thought they only came as a pair. Maybe I couldn't have purchased my supplemental health program unless I had both A and B coverage. Possibility? Quote
Bonnie Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 25 minutes ago, Marcelyn said: I didn't know it was possible to have Part A and not also enroll for Part B for Medicare. I've always had both and thought they only came as a pair. Maybe I couldn't have purchased my supplemental health program unless I had both A and B coverage. Possibility? You are automatically enrolled in Medicare Part A, which is limited hospital coverage. You have to enroll in and pay for Part B coverage (doctors, non-emergency procedures, etc.) Yes, you would have to be enrolled in Part B to purchase a supplemental program because it supplements both Parts. I liken Part A to the so-called Hospital Chiriqui plan here. It gets you into the hospital, but it may not get you the treatment you need. You need at least Part B for that, and for more complete coverage a supplemental health plan. Quote
Marcelyn Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 22 minutes ago, Bonnie said: You are automatically enrolled in Medicare Part A, which is limited hospital coverage. You have to enroll in and pay for Part B coverage (doctors, non-emergency procedures, etc.) Yes, you would have to be enrolled in Part B to purchase a supplemental program because it supplements both Parts. I liken Part A to the so-called Hospital Chiriqui plan here. It gets you into the hospital, but it may not get you the treatment you need. You need at least Part B for that, and for more complete coverage a supplemental health plan. Thanks, Bonnie. Clear answer. Quote
Jim Tosch Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Sometimes I wonder why everyone, including Christians want to live so long. If you have had a great life do you really want to go through repetitive surgeries and live in special care facilities. For many of you it is simply delaying what you believe is heaven. For others it is just delaying the inevitable. Live fast, die young and forget Plan B. Use plan helium, just keep a full tank nearby. Quote
Bonnie Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 4 minutes ago, Jim Tosch said: Sometimes I wonder why everyone, including Christians want to live so long. If you have had a great life do you really want to go through repetitive surgeries and live in special care facilities. For many of you it is simply delaying what you believe is heaven. For others it is just delaying the inevitable. Live fast, die young and forget Plan B. Use plan helium, just keep a full tank nearby. It isn't necessarily wanting to live so long, Jim. We end up going to hospitals and doctors for reasons other than imminent death. The amelioration of suffering figures strongly into the decision of whether to have adequate health insurance or not. If it comes to one's final days, I don't know anyone who would choose to spend them in Hospital Regional without pain medication, and I understand that pain medication is not routine here, especially if the patient can't pay for it. Finally, all expats should be insured so as not to be a drain on the Panamanian health system. (I can't understand why Panama doesn't require proof of health insurance for residency.) Quote
Jim Tosch Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Bonnie, I am one thousand percent on your side against pain. I am simply bewildered by heart transplants, chemo and the many life extending (temporarily) efforts that cost fortunes. Philosophically it is illogical, economically it is impractical, why can't people just die at their peak, just think of it as retiring. Quote
Jim Tosch Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 Bonnie, you may have just suggested an idea for new expat coverage. For a small fee per month you receive whatever pain relief necessary to see you through your ultimate day. 1 Quote
Bonnie Posted November 19, 2015 Posted November 19, 2015 1 hour ago, Jim Tosch said: Bonnie, you may have just suggested an idea for new expat coverage. For a small fee per month you receive whatever pain relief necessary to see you through your ultimate day. Easier said than done, I imagine. I assume that you're joking. I have a good sense of humor, but I don't consider health insurance a laughing matter. I see what has happened to people without it. Quote
Bonnie Posted November 19, 2015 Posted November 19, 2015 20 minutes ago, Jim Tosch said: why would you think I am joking? Because your "solution" so clearly fails to address many aspects of the problem: non-fatal car accident, severe bacterial infection requiring hospitalization, non-fatal stroke or heart attack, etc. Any number of conditions could require extended hospitalization but not be life threatening. And without health insurance the costs fall on the Panamanian government, which already is stretched. 1 Quote
Marcelyn Posted November 19, 2015 Posted November 19, 2015 12 hours ago, Bonnie said: Because your "solution" so clearly fails to address many aspects of the problem: non-fatal car accident, severe bacterial infection requiring hospitalization, non-fatal stroke or heart attack, etc. Any number of conditions could require extended hospitalization but not be life threatening. And without health insurance the costs fall on the Panamanian government, which already is stretched. I agree, Bonnie. Besides the costs that may be paid by the Panamanian government, I can't remember how many times we've been asked to donate money for someone's medical expenses. Many of the requests are for people we don't even know. We had a bad experience in Mexico early this year which involved a bit more than a week in a hospital. Great hospital and staff--wanted full payment before we checked out. Glad we had insurance or I'm not sure how this would have ended. (There was no one to ask for a money donation.) Quote
JudyS Posted November 19, 2015 Posted November 19, 2015 14 hours ago, Jim Tosch said: Bonnie, I am one thousand percent on your side against pain. I am simply bewildered by heart transplants, chemo and the many life extending (temporarily) efforts that cost fortunes. Philosophically it is illogical, economically it is impractical, why can't people just die at their peak, just think of it as retiring. The body has its own agenda. Even if you want to die and are ready, the body hangs on. It is programmed for survival, not philosophy. It will hang on beyond all reason. That is why enlightened states in the U.S. have passed laws to allow assisted suicide, to prevent prolonged, useless suffering when there is no chance of recovery. It is highly unlikely such laws will ever exist in Panama. Quote
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