Jubilado Discounts

[Keith Woolford]

This is a link to the Operating Manual for Ley 6 of 1987 which establishes Jubilado discounts in Panama. Includes definitions and explanations, although in Spanish.

Regarding restaurant 'specials', it does state in Article 5 that if there is a meal being offered at a promotional price, the consumer has the option of choosing the promotion or a regular menu item with discount.

http://www.acodeco.gob.pa/acodeco/uploads/pdf/nuestra_labor/LeyJubilados.08_28_2009_09_15_02_a.m..pdf

[Bonnie]

10 hours ago, Keith Woolford said:

This is a link to the Operating Manual for Ley 6 of 1987 which establishes Jubilado discounts in Panama. Includes definitions and explanations, although in Spanish.

Regarding restaurant 'specials', it does state in Article 5 that if there is a meal being offered at a promotional price, the consumer has the option of choosing the promotion or a regular menu item with discount.

http://www.acodeco.gob.pa/acodeco/uploads/pdf/nuestra_labor/LeyJubilados.08_28_2009_09_15_02_a.m..pdf

I would think that the key word here is "meal." I don't see how an entire menu can be declared "promotional." That would make the law meaningless.

[Marcelyn]

If as asserted that a restaurant can deduct the Jubilado discount as a cost or expense when doing their tax returns.......then what is the real problem for an eatery not wanting to offer this discount to customers?

Need help to understand this thinking.

[Keith Woolford]

The concept of a deduction from taxes at some point in the future doesn't help someone who needs cash in their register to pay expenses today.

Again, this shows a lack of sophistication and management planning on the part of a business operator.

Typical is this statement about "figuring things out as we go".

"We honor the jubilado discount when it applies and are still figuring things out as we go, we are certain all of you understand that it takes time to fully get the scope of things in a new country with its unique laws and rules, sometimes information is not clear, answers are nowhere to be found and ambiguity is present in many processes.

[Roger B]

22 hours ago, Keith Woolford said:

Regarding restaurant 'specials', it does state in Article 5 that if there is a meal being offered at a promotional price, the consumer has the option of choosing the promotion or a regular menu item with discount.

 

There are restaurants that on working days offered what is called: Almuerzos Ejecutivos or something like "Executive Lunch Meals"  that have a very low price.  Usually they have two or three options to chose.  It covers generally: a small soup, a main dish, a drink and a dessert.  They could have one that has chicken and other that have beef or fish.  It depends on what the chef and/or owner decided that day.  They are considered "specials" and of course are not covered by the jubilado discount.   If you dont feel like having any of those specials of the day then you could ask for the menu and order from it and claim your jubilado discount.  

It is needed that the management of the restaurant states in a sign or in an attached paper to the menu what is the special or promotion of the day and show the price of it.    

[Roger B]

11 hours ago, Bonnie said:

I would think that the key word here is "meal." I don't see how an entire menu can be declared "promotional." That would make the law meaningless.

Bonnie:

I couldnt and shouldnt declare the entire meny as promotional.  If they are not fast food franchises and/or little restaurants or fondas they couldnt declare the whole menu as promotional.  It is against this law and they could be fined.   

 

[Roger B]

8 hours ago, Marcelyn said:

If as asserted that a restaurant can deduct the Jubilado discount as a cost or expense when doing their tax returns.......then what is the real problem for an eatery not wanting to offer this discount to customers?

Need help to understand this thinking.

Marcelyn

 

This law was passed in 1987.  General Noriega was still in power!!  When the new era of the democratic governments started again in Panama there was a chance for the Unions and business chambers and organization to eliminate the law.  Nobody claim or did something about it.   It was regulated then and some minor changes were done.  

In Panama City it is working very well and business people are doing good without problems.  Remember that in PC we have the largest amount of local and foreing people that qualify for the discount.  

I guess the problem is ignorance of the law and not having a good accountant or CPA that explain them the law and that it wont affect seriously its finance.   I dont know how much is the markup in a regular restaurant but I guess it is over 35%.  I dont think they are working for less than that.  Impossible.  So if the discount is about 25% of the total price in that specific transaction they will still have a profit.  Less money but still a profit.  They will cover the cost and retain a minimum profit.  But they will be compensated at the end of the fiscal period when they do their tax return.  All those discounts given will go directly to the deductions allowed by law and will reduce your income on your books and they will be paying less income tax.  It is so simple.... but it is sometimes too hard for some people to understand.   They are looking the immediate effect but not the overall effect at the tax return process.

 

So for me, at the end, it is a matter of ignorance of the law and accounting procedures.

Edited April 25, 2016 by Roger B

[Marcelyn]

Roger B. Thanks for your excellent answer to my question. Your last statement is an important one.

[Pat]

On April 25, 2016 at 7:18 PM, Roger B said:

Marcelyn

 

This law was passed in 1987.  General Noriega was still in power!!  When the new era of the democratic governments started again in Panama there was a chance for the Unions and business chambers and organization to eliminate the law.  Nobody claim or did something about it.   It was regulated then and some minor changes were done.  

In Panama City it is working very well and business people are doing good without problems.  Remember that in PC we have the largest amount of local and foreing people that qualify for the discount.  

I guess the problem is ignorance of the law and not having a good accountant or CPA that explain them the law and that it wont affect seriously its finance.   I dont know how much is the markup in a regular restaurant but I guess it is over 35%.  I dont think they are working for less than that.  Impossible.  So if the discount is about 25% of the total price in that specific transaction they will still have a profit.  Less money but still a profit.  They will cover the cost and retain a minimum profit.  But they will be compensated at the end of the fiscal period when they do their tax return.  All those discounts given will go directly to the deductions allowed by law and will reduce your income on your books and they will be paying less income tax.  It is so simple.... but it is sometimes too hard for some people to understand.   They are looking the immediate effect but not the overall effect at the tax return process.

 

So for me, at the end, it is a matter of ignorance of the law and accounting procedures.

Roger:. You and a number of other people (except Colibri and Retrogusto restaurant owners) understand the law for Jubilado Discount. Time to visit ACODECO.

[Bud]

While at ACODECO in David today taking care of some business, I picked up a brochure about the application of Ley 6, which is the law about jubilado discounts. I am posting it here as pictures and also as a downloadable PDF.

 

 

ACODECO Ley 6 Jubilados Pensionados y Tercera Edad - 20160427.pdf

[Roger B]

6 hours ago, Pat said:

Roger:. You and a number of other people (except Colibri and Retrogusto restaurant owners) understand the law for Jubilado Discount. Time to visit ACODECO.

Sure.

It is the law and they have to comply with it.

You can file a denuncia at ACODECO and they will do an investigation about those two business.  

[Roger B]

18 minutes ago, Bud said:

While at ACODECO in David today taking care of some business, I picked up a brochure about the application of Ley 6, which is the law about jubilado discounts. I am posting it here as pictures and also as a downloadable PDF.

 

 

ACODECO Ley 6 Jubilados Pensionados y Tercera Edad - 20160427.pdf

 

People.  One additional reason to practice and learn your spanish.   Know your rights.   This law is for all legal residents of the Republic of Panama.  You as a foreign citizen but with legal residence in Panama can enjoy with not problem of the benefits of this law.  Look at the list of all the services and goods you could have a discount.  Also there is preferential treatment.   As a jubilado you have preference for the attention at any public and private office.  Remember that discount is personal and will be given to you only.  For all what you consume and use.

[Bud]

2 hours ago, Roger B said:

 

People.  One additional reason to practice and learn your spanish.   Know your rights.   This law is for all legal residents of the Republic of Panama.  You as a foreign citizen but with legal residence in Panama can enjoy with not problem of the benefits of this law.  Look at the list of all the services and goods you could have a discount.  Also there is preferential treatment.   As a jubilado you have preference for the attention at any public and private office.  Remember that discount is personal and will be given to you only.  For all what you consume and use.

Roger,

You bring up a very important point. The jubilado discount is for persons who qualify for the discount. Part of that qualification is to be a legal resident in Panama as well as jubilado status. In particular, note the words on the bottom left of the second page as shown above, which identifies the identity documents necessary to establish one's status.

[Roger B]

It will be good that all of you got one copy of this pamphlet with you and show it to those business that are not giving you the discount you deserve because of this law.

The word ACODECO scare a lot of those bad business.

 

[Keith Woolford]

LaPrensa published a very detailed article yesterday outlining eligibility, benefits and discounts.

http://www.prensa.com/sociedad/descuentos-derecho-jubilados-mayores-Panama_0_4591790796.html

Edited October 7, 2016 by Keith Woolford